Curse

JDRyder · Sep 05, 2009, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teh Jace

BTW: Aion is just another themepark WoW clone with shallow combat system and ubergay gear threadmill endgame so I don't rly think pvpers from GW will see it as an alternative.

From my understanding its just not going to be as competitive, which i don't think any MMO/RPG could be as competitive as guild wars unless someone came out with a guild wars emu and rolled back GvG so we had VoD again.

PvP community aside it will kill the PvE community in GW, theres no doubt in my mind about that. Hopefully this means they spend all their budget on GvG and PvE never gets another update.

-Vertex- · Sep 05, 2009, 05:35 AM // 05:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snow Bunny

it's easier to get matches in GvG than TA, which is saying something.

The only time when you have trouble getting matches in TA is at Euro morning/American night aka dead hours. It's also the time where you wait 30 minutes for a GvG and regularly skip from UW to HoH.

snaek · Sep 05, 2009, 01:05 PM // 13:05

ta is not hard to get into a match at all, because of all the ra leftovers. besides if we were going by the most popular formats purely based on numbers, i'm pretty sure the "best" pvp format would be ra. so anet, please give ra ladders and a mat and we will see gw pvp thrive once again.

The Josip · Sep 05, 2009, 01:47 PM // 13:47

TA needs to go.

Sorry - this was my favorite Arena back in Prophecies. After Gladiator title it got ruined by lame grinding teams who play same builds over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again until all other brain cells die except the ones needed to run that build.

Again, I am sorry but a long time ago this was a fun relaxed arena where people used to test various builds, have fun running various builds, and the reason why it was so fun is exactly that variety that was possible in TA. The moment some of you started to grind the title is the moment TA died. And I think you know who you are.

RiP, and let's bring sealed deck - a concept which revolves around FUN. Something unknown to current TA players so I'm sure there will be a lot of animosity. Great.

Corporeal Ghost · Sep 05, 2009, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by sLiceR

4) Nerf WoH (make guardian good again?)
5) Nerf shove spike into oblivion: thats griefing, not playing.
6) Tone eda down just a little. Mantaining blind on 3 different players is a bit too much.
7) Buff enchant removal both on necros and other professions. I know rend is going to get abused in GvG maybe revert to 1sec and make it remove 2 enchants and lower its recharge time to the one of eda.

Despite the fact that two people already jumped on this, it still needs to be highlighted. You can't have dual 5e/10r enchantment strips (with bonus effects, no less) AND Defile Defenses and still want Guardian to be viable. If you want Guardian back, you need to kill the Necro. At very least, Rip and Defile need to be toned down quite a bit.

Also, I enjoy TA and such. Could probably be pretty successful if we had a fourth man and stopped running honorbalance.

Sierraa · Sep 05, 2009, 04:22 PM // 16:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Josip

TA needs to go.

Sorry - this was my favorite Arena back in Prophecies. After Gladiator title it got ruined by lame grinding teams who play same builds over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again until all other brain cells die except the ones needed to run that build.

Again, I am sorry but a long time ago this was a fun relaxed arena where people used to test various builds, have fun running various builds, and the reason why it was so fun is exactly that variety that was possible in TA. The moment some of you started to grind the title is the moment TA died. And I think you know who you are.

RiP, and let's bring sealed deck - a concept which revolves around FUN. Something unknown to current TA players so I'm sure there will be a lot of animosity. Great.

If people want to farm you should let them. I don't complain about people who run gimmicks or bash their heads against a wall, because it usually means a free win for me. I have fun in TA playing whatever my team decides to run, title is just a bonus.

Sealed deck isn't fun for me for the same reason AB isn't fun. I don't like it, I don't like the idea, and it's just not my cup of tea. It's another arena for pvers, that doesn't really require any skill. At the rate that things are declining though I wouldn't be surprised if they removed HA next since it's a grind rank discrimanation fest according to the player base.

Vazze · Sep 05, 2009, 04:39 PM // 16:39

I look at it this way, a new format is added, and further fragmentation of the remaining player base should be avoided so something has to go. Online worlds, especially GW don't know death, content is constantly added but is never deleted, things get buffed but not nerfed and rarely anything ever changes. I don't think this is healthy. Maybe GW's model (subscription free) is not suited for a more active world, but this is a moment when they actually try and I am with them even if I liked TA.

Teh Jace · Sep 05, 2009, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vazze

I look at it this way, a new format is added, and further fragmentation of the remaining player base should be avoided so something has to go.

Do u rly think that the dedicated TA players will go play a shitty random format for pvers? They will just go away = population reduced.

Playing champions online now. I am not into the whole superhero thing that much but it has a good arena pvp system where /faceroll doesn't equal win like in GW.

Corporeal Ghost · Sep 06, 2009, 12:36 AM // 00:36

Do you guys really see Sealed Deck as a PvE-dominated format? It's going to take a huge amount of game knowledge just to stay competitive at a reasonable level. Or am I misconstruing and you just think the format will mostly be played by PvE players, but dominated by the few who know what they're doing (a la TA)?

Although if it's implemented with anything but mirror builds, I may have to retract any and all statements about it.

Sierraa · Sep 06, 2009, 01:21 AM // 01:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

Do you guys really see Sealed Deck as a PvE-dominated format? It's going to take a huge amount of game knowledge just to stay competitive at a reasonable level. Or am I misconstruing and you just think the format will mostly be played by PvE players, but dominated by the few who know what they're doing (a la TA)?

Although if it's implemented with anything but mirror builds, I may have to retract any and all statements about it.

pve = sealed deck.

I can put a random set of skills on my bar, roll my head across my keyboard and win, which is why it's attractive to pvers.

Corporeal Ghost · Sep 06, 2009, 03:47 AM // 03:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander Burn Victim

pve = sealed deck.

I can put a random set of skills on my bar, roll my head across my keyboard and win, which is why it's attractive to pvers.

The same can be said of every format currently in the game minus the random (or plus the random if you're so inclined). It has nothing to do with PvE--it's partially due to the way the game has been balanced and partially due to people building roles for bad/high-pinging players into their 8-man teams.

Limited formats always take a greater degree of game knowledge to play successfully than do constructed formats. PvE players see skills. People with game knowledge see synergy and routes to accomplishing match goals. This will be especially true if the matches are not straight annihilation, in which case you have a difference between the "best bar" and the "best bar for the job at hand".

But ultimately, I think it will be less attractive to the PvE crowd once the initial novelty wears off. There will be no Escape Ranger or Distortion Mindblasts to cover for mistakes. Weaker skills will place a much greater emphasis on individual and team decisions. The face-rolling, as you describe it, will be minimized by the very nature of the format, which is what attracts most of its proponents.

If you don't like the idea of the format, that's fine, but don't trivialize it.

FoxBat · Sep 06, 2009, 05:14 AM // 05:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

Limited formats always take a greater degree of game knowledge to play successfully than do constructed formats.

So far the word is a week for everyone to play around with a set of skills - that's pretty close to a constructed format.

Still it probably beats shovespike, necbalanced and everything else eh?

Greedy Gus · Sep 06, 2009, 11:06 AM // 11:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander Burn Victim

pve = sealed deck.

I can put a random set of skills on my bar, roll my head across my keyboard and win, which is why it's attractive to pvers.

Maybe you don't realize that sealed deck was most advocated for years ago by mostly gvgers on the highest level, who kept the concept alive through irc/alliance drawn scrims, though most have surely quit by now.

Sierraa · Sep 06, 2009, 06:40 PM // 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

Maybe you don't realize that sealed deck was most advocated for years ago by mostly gvgers on the highest level, who kept the concept alive through irc/alliance drawn scrims, though most have surely quit by now.

I do realize it, in fact I used to play sealed deck a lot. It's still attractive to pvers because ultimately they're the remaining player base left. The people who are decent are always going to be on a different level than those who are not. The gap between good and bad in GW is awful. (Thanks to pve skills/face rolling etc)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

The same can be said of every format currently in the game minus the random (or plus the random if you're so inclined). It has nothing to do with PvE--it's partially due to the way the game has been balanced and partially due to people building roles for bad/high-pinging players into their 8-man teams.

The game has been declining due to bad skill updates, people leaving, pve being made obnoxiously easy, and ofc the age of the game. The game isn't balanced at all, I play with Americans and Euros who both bring rangers, regardless of high ping and servers. I run on wireless and I still want to play ranger even if I'm at a disadvantage.

I used to leech my wireless and I play infuser, and the day I got actual internet I was pre-infusing because I wasn't used to having a lower ping. ;\ If people were building roles based on bad/high ping I would be on bitch bars, and not on a monk.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

Limited formats always take a greater degree of game knowledge to play successfully than do constructed formats. PvE players see skills. People with game knowledge see synergy and routes to accomplishing match goals. This will be especially true if the matches are not straight annihilation, in which case you have a difference between the "best bar" and the "best bar for the job at hand".

You can still face-roll and do decently at any format. Face-roll harder than everyone else and you might be considered good. You don't have to know how your skills work together to do well in any of the arenas, most of the meta bars are spam worthy. I understand what you're saying though, but at this point in time, the good players completely obliterate everyone else regardless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corporeal Ghost

But ultimately, I think it will be less attractive to the PvE crowd once the initial novelty wears off. There will be no Escape Ranger or Distortion Mindblasts to cover for mistakes. Weaker skills will place a much greater emphasis on individual and team decisions. The face-rolling, as you describe it, will be minimized by the very nature of the format, which is what attracts most of its proponents.

If you don't like the idea of the format, that's fine, but don't trivialize it.

Maybe, but there's not going to be anyone to actively punish for the mistakes. People don't or won't know how to capitalize on mistakes of the other team will continue to face-roll and slowly learn how to be better. Sure sealed deck takes a tiny bit of thought, but I used to put together the most random bars and make it through pve, why is sealed deck any different?

It's pretty well known that a lot of the decent people have long quit the game and have no intentions of coming back, taking out TA (which is something I enjoy) for something that I consider on the same level of AB, RA, and other "pve" pvp formats isn't something I'm going to actively praise.

I don't recommend removing anything from a dying game in the first place. I'd much rather new content be added, or existing problems fixed.

Elir · Sep 07, 2009, 04:51 AM // 04:51

lallallalallalllalalllaaaaaaaaa balanced.

/signed

just needs some fixes and a ladder, also i can see some (W/R/N/Mo BALANCED) grinders mad already about the idea of removing all they can do in the whole game, yes TA is my favourite pvp format its 8 minutes per match, 4 players doesn't take long to get 3 friends and play, competitive (Buildwars/ganking can be amazing).

some hints for Anet (like they care:P):
1. nerf shove spike
2.nerf the grinding build (W/R/N/Mo) one build shouldn't beat everything that is not even close to "Balanced lululul".
3.give back hero battles split maps OR add some TACTICS for TA(instead of brainless killing).
4.add a tournament and a ladder
5.maybe a chest.
6.last: nerf apply poison, i have a problem with this skill you just cant to anything about it (maybe get magebane and camp his apply but ofc i will get called fagget/shitter all day)

A Message to angry grinders: Although i love TA but i am happy that i wont see a (W/R/N/Mo) again ^____________________^

gogogo u have three weeks to grind your next glad rank(idk about karla and id tho)

Have fun!

Elir

Si Mana · Sep 07, 2009, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander Burn Victim

The game has been declining due to bad skill updates, people leaving, pve being made obnoxiously easy, and ofc the age of the game.

It's pretty well known that a lot of the decent people have long quit the game and have no intentions of coming back, taking out TA (which is something I enjoy) for something that I consider on the same level of AB, RA, and other "pve" pvp formats isn't something I'm going to actively praise.

I don't recommend removing anything from a dying game in the first place. I'd much rather new content be added, or existing problems fixed.

A BIG NO to removing TA.
A BIG YES to skill updates to improve the state of play in all PVP arenas long neglected.

I know plenty of players who will leave the game should TA be removed and l'm disappointed that Anet keep implementing new systems without fixing existing problems, not just in PVP either.
It seems common sense that Anet would work harder to keep their existing client base by fixing ongoing neglected existing problems.

Do they just want to push people to buy Aion till GW2 release as a way of winding down player base in GW1? I won't buy Aion cause it lacks the PVP l want, nor will l buy GW2 for the same above reasons, also unless they actually add some Pacific servers for Australian players. Honestly, we're lucky to get a 180ms ping (my best) and mostly its in excess of 500+ on euro servers ( Aus evening), while my Euro friends have pings of 15-50ms avg, and QQ and refuse to play if they get 400ms ping. LOL
Other Mmo's have dedicated servers in Aus, why not GW.

I read an article somewhere recently that really made me think GW had a great and original advantage over other mmo's in their PVP format.
The concept that people start the game in Pve, then work through Pvp formats is really unique and well thought game design imo.

Pve'ers can do AB/JQ/FA/RA for a taste of PVP, and main arenas are left for people who want some serious structured play.
Reading GW2's version of PVP is not reassuring either, and l'm wondering if this is a build up to the lack of structured PVP formats in GW2, since l've read that there will be no RA/TA/HA at all, only some GVG format and a world pve/pvp Mists area which just sounds like the free for all shambles that exists in WoW and Warhammer.

Some questions also, should they actually be foolish enough to remove TA:
What happens after 10 in RA?
How do players get to HA?
What happens to the Glads title?

As for sealed deck play, l can see two sides of it, fine if it replaces HB, leave TA alone!

Revelations · Sep 07, 2009, 01:17 PM // 13:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander Burn Victim

I used to put together the most random bars and make it through pve, why is sealed deck any different

Because sealed deck pits you against AI mobs, amirite?

Why the f*ck are you honestly comparing TA with limited and changing skillset to PvE?

I mean - don't get me wrong, I'm pretty pissed at the loss of TA. And if the poster you're quoting is who I think he is, then he's mourning it's loss also. But he's right. The arena isn't going to cater to PvErs any more than TA does now, simply by it's very nature. If you honestly think it's going to be a button mashing arena you are horribly horribly wrong. Pretty sure that when you take away any overpowered crutches from a PvP format then it's the PvErs that suffer.

the_deSKtructor · Sep 07, 2009, 01:43 PM // 13:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revelations

Because sealed deck pits you against AI mobs, amirite?

Why the f*ck are you honestly comparing TA with limited and changing skillset to PvE?

I mean - don't get me wrong, I'm pretty pissed at the loss of TA. And if the poster you're quoting is who I think he is, then he's mourning it's loss also. But he's right. The arena isn't going to cater to PvErs any more than TA does now, simply by it's very nature. If you honestly think it's going to be a button mashing arena you are horribly horribly wrong. Pretty sure that when you take away any overpowered crutches from a PvP format then it's the PvErs that suffer.

Nobody said that SD is going to have the same mechanics as TA. My biggest worry is that they are going to implement some NPC/capping reliant format.

Sierraa · Sep 07, 2009, 02:57 PM // 14:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Si Mana

A BIG NO to removing TA.
A BIG YES to skill updates to improve the state of play in all PVP arenas long neglected.

Hey you summed up what I think :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revelations

Because sealed deck pits you against AI mobs, amirite?

Why the f*ck are you honestly comparing TA with limited and changing skillset to PvE?

I mean - don't get me wrong, I'm pretty pissed at the loss of TA. And if the poster you're quoting is who I think he is, then he's mourning it's loss also. But he's right. The arena isn't going to cater to PvErs any more than TA does now, simply by it's very nature. If you honestly think it's going to be a button mashing arena you are horribly horribly wrong. Pretty sure that when you take away any overpowered crutches from a PvP format then it's the PvErs that suffer.

AI > Majority of the playerbase.

Maybe you're right and I'm horribly wrong, but that's what I think is going to happen. Neither of us are right until it gets released.

Revelations · Sep 07, 2009, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_deSKtructor

Nobody said that SD is going to have the same mechanics as TA. My biggest worry is that they are going to implement some NPC/capping reliant format.

Given the fact that the HB maps are likely to be modified for it I would probably concur on some capping element. However this still shifts the balance of power further toward the PvPers side. I doubt that NPCs are planned for the format, though I could very well be mistaken on this.

I have no doubt that the PvE crowd are going to descend on the arena like flies to shit. Simply due to their massive population they will fill the arena for the initial release. However players with strong PvP experience involving skills/builds/metas are in all likelihood going to absolutely farm the living crap out of the PvE crowd. Probably more so than an arena like TA where said PvErs have shit like gothspike to score them the occasional win.

Give it a couple months and time for people to get a few ranks of the title and you'll have all the PvErs on the sideline crying about another format they can't play and a bunch of regulars who'll simply destroy most others in the arena.